In this thought-provoking episode of The Patrick Coffin Show, Patrick engages in a rather detailed, and somewhat technical, conversation with canon lawyer Marc Balestrieri to address two hot-button topics within the Catholic Church: the schismatic claims surrounding Archbishop Carlo Maria Viganò and the mounting evidence that Pope Francis (Jorge Bergoglio) could be considered an antipope.
Guest Marc Balestrieri is founder and president of Canonical Aid, an international canon law service helping lay and clergy with canonical issues. He is licensed to practice before any ecclesiastical court in the world, except the tribunals of the Holy See, and specializes in the nullity of Marriage, penal canon law, rotal Jurisprudence and praxis, and the rights of clerics and the faithful.
He was recruited to serve as a staff canonist for the Sacred Roman Rota in the Vatican for the Holy See, and his record includes service in the United States for the Archdioceses of Saint Paul & Minneapolis, Saint Louis, and Los Angeles; England for the Archdiocese of Westminster; and France for the Archdiocese of Strasbourg.
In this interview, Balestrieri offers a detailed analysis of the canonical definitions of schism and whether Viganò’s outspoken critiques of Francis, in light of the July 2024 Vatican announcement of Viganò’s excommunication for schism. They explore Viganò’s controversial stance on issues like the Second Vatican Council and his sharp critiques of the Vatican’s leadership.
The conversation then pivots to the question of Bergoglio’s legitimacy as pope. Balestrieri shares insights into historical and canonical precedents that fuel arguments for and against the idea that Francis may not be the true successor of St. Peter. Patrick and Marc discuss the impact these debates have on the faithful and the Church’s unity, encouraging listeners to think critically about the current papal crisis.
Tune in for a fascinating exploration of modern ecclesial controversies, and what it all means for Catholics worldwide.
Topics covered in this episode:
The proper definition of schism
The differences between the 1917 Pio-Benedictine Code of Canon Law
The dilemma of being on trial for excommunication and schism when you don’t recognize the validity of the antagonist-judges
The relevant canons for papal resignation and the distinction between munus (office or gift) and ministerium (external functions)
Principles for maintaining hope in an upside down Church under Bergoglio
The controversies surrounding the St. Gallen Mafia’s misadventures in the lead up and voting pattern in the March 2013 Conclave
Resources mentioned in this episode:
Marc Balestrieri’s website: https://www.canonicalaid.org/home.html
Pope Emeritus? The Always Is Also a Forever by Estefania Acosta Ochoa
Chapters:
00:00:00 – The Status of Archbishop Car Maria Vio
00:02:05 – A Titanic Reunion with Mark
00:04:22 – Comparison of Teaching Styles in Catholic Church Texts
00:06:45 – Teaching of Uman V’s Main Concern
00:08:59 – Material Heresy and Divine Faith
00:11:05 – The Opinions on Papal Heresy
00:13:25 – Heresy and Deposition of Popes
00:15:39 – Formal Heresy and Amoris Letizia
00:17:52 – Formal Heresy and Church Teaching
00:20:04 – God’s Love and Being a Saint
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